奥琳埃娜・法拉奇：天安门上的毛主席像，是否要永远保留下去？
Oriana Fallaci: Will Chairman Mao's portrait above Tiananmen Gate be kept there?
过去毛主席像挂得太多，到处都挂，并不是一件严肃的事情，也并不能表明对毛主席的尊重。
In the past there were too many portraits of Chairman Mao.
They were hung everywhere.
That was not proper and it didn't really show respect for Chairman Mao.
尽管毛主席过去有段时间也犯了错误，但他终究是中国共产党、中华人民共和国的主要缔造者。
It's true that he made mistakes in a certain period, but he was after all a principal founder of the Chinese Communist Party and the People's Republic of China.
他为中国人民做的事情是不能抹杀的。
What he did for the Chinese people can never be erased.
但大跃进本身的主要责任还是毛主席的。
Still, it is Chairman Mao who should be held primarily responsible for the Great Leap Forward.
当时，经过几个月的时间，毛主席首先很快地发觉了这些错误，提出改正这些错误。
But it didn't take him long -- just a few months -- to recognize his mistake, and he did so +before the rest of us and proposed corrections.
由于其他因素，这个改正没有贯彻下去。
^-1 And in 962, when because of some other factors those corrections had not been fully carried out,
但毕竟对这些教训总结不够，导致爆发了“文化大革命”。
But the lessons were not fully drawn, and as a result the “Cultural Revolution” erupted.
搞“文化大革命”，就毛主席本身的愿望来说，是出于避免资本主义复辟的考虑，但对中国本身的实际情况作了错误的估计。
So far as Chairman Mao's own hopes were concerned, he initiated the “Cultural Revolution” in order to avert the restoration of capitalism, but he had made an erroneous assessment of China's actual situation.
首先把革命的对象搞错了，导致了抓所谓“党内走资本主义道路的当权派”。
In the first place, the targets of the revolution were wrongly defined, which led to the effort to ferret out “capitalist roaders in power in the Party”.
这样打击了原来在革命中有建树的、有实际经验的各级领导干部，其中包括刘少奇同志在内。
Blows were dealt at leading cadres at all levels who had made contributions to the revolution and had practical experience, including Comrade Liu Shaoqi.
毛主席在去世前一两年讲过，文化大革命有两个错误，一个是“打倒一切”，一个是“全面内战”。
In the last couple of years before Chairman Mao's death he said that the “Cultural Revolution” had been wrong on two counts: one was “overthrowing all”, and the other was waging a “full-scale civil war”.
只就这两点讲，就已经不能说“文化大革命”是正确的。
These two counts alone show that the “Cultural Revolution” cannot be called correct.
另一方面，错误被林彪、“四人帮”这两个反革命集团利用了。
On the other hand, it was taken advantage of by the two counter-revolutionary cliques headed by Lin Biao and the Gang of Four,
所以要区别毛主席的错误同林彪、“四人帮”的罪行。
Therefore, we should draw a line between Chairman Mao's mistakes and the crimes of Lin Biao and the Gang of Four.
奥：但我们大家都知道，是毛主席选择了林彪，就像西方的国王选择继承人那样，选择了林彪。
Question: But we all know that it was Chairman Mao himself who chose Lin Biao1 as his successor, much in the same way as an emperor chooses his heir.
刚才我说我们制度不健全，其中也包括这个在内。
It is an illustration of the imperfections in our institutions which I referred to a moment ago.
我们要实事求是地讲毛主席后期的错误。
We will adopt a realistic approach towards the mistakes he made late in life.
毛泽东思想是毛主席一生中正确的部分。
which represents the correct part of Chairman Mao's life.
毛泽东思想不仅过去引导我们取得革命的胜利，现在和将来还应该是中国党和国家的宝贵财富。
Not only did Mao Zedong Thought lead us to victory in the revolution in the past; it is -- and will continue to be -- a treasured possession of the Chinese Communist Party and of our country.
奥：这是否意味着在审判“四人帮”和开下一届党代会时，毛主席的名字不可避免地会提到？
Question: Do you mean to say that the name of Chairman Mao will inevitably come up when the Gang of Four is brought to trial as well as when you have your next Party congress?”
不光在党代会，在其他场合也要提到。
Not only at the next Party congress but also on other occasions.
但是审判“四人帮”不会影响毛主席。
But the trial of the Gang of Four will not detract from Chairman Mao's prestige.
当然，用“四人帮”，毛主席是有责任的。
Of course, he was responsible for putting them in their positions.